dragonflee - its easy to see how all of these things are related. If I'm feeling anxious, it increases my pure o thoughts and then i feel depressed at times because I'm tired of this crap. I hope the recent increase in my zoloft up to 75 will put me where I was before I stupidly went off zoloft... we will see. But I'm also working closely with a therapist because I don't want to continue this cycle forever.
Alicia1003 - how are you doing today? I'll be doing fine and then have the thoughts like we do and then it makes me really nervous!! This condition is so annoying. When I do distract myself with activity or going somewhere, I am a lot better and don't tend to dwell. How about you all?
I know this sounds crazy
-
Guest
Alicia you are not alone sometimes i to got the thought of hurting someone else. on many occassion i would see a knife on my kitchen counter and i felt like put it away beacause i had thought of hurting myself. Sometimes i thought about hurting my grandparents which is something that i will never do we must be strong and turn to THE HIGHER POWER GOD WITH OUT HIM WE CAN't OVERCOME THIS THOUGHTS BE STRONG. Remember you are not alone and your not crazy either we are going to be okay always remember that.I am sure that this program will help us alot when ever you get those thoughs just say to yourself hell no i would never do that. They are just thoughts. Focus your mind on something else such as reading and even listening to music sometimes i do that.
-
Guest
Hi GUY this Arleny i recently started the program its i have not gotten a diagnosis yet i don't know if i have depression, anxiety or both but i do expereince and are experincing some of the symptoms. This summer that past i been different my mind does not feel the same way. I AM NOT AS VIBRANT as i use to be i get sleepy most of the days can someone speak to me about their symptoms how they feel. sometimes i cry beacuase i dont want to feel this way. i dont want to drink medication.
-
Guest
No you are not crazy. Did you know there are about two million people in the U.S. alone that have OCD and many of ussuffer in silence. However, there is some very encouraging and overwheleming proof that no matter how strange, weird, bizarre, gross your thoughts are you will probably (99.9%) never act upon them. What seperates OCD sufferers from the Charles Manson, Susan Smith, Andrea Yates, Scott Peterson is that we feel guilt, shame, remorse etc for the mire fact of thinking about horrible things. So in other words we have a conscious. They on the other hand had no conscious, felt no remorse, and enjoyed what they were doing. They saw pleasure in what they did for whatever reason. If you want to get a good understanding of what OCD is all about and how to overcome it get the book 'IMP of Mind" by Lee Baer. I wish someone had told me about this book years ago. I wouldn't have tortued myself like the way I did. You know like all the "what ifs" that never materialize to anything except more worry and increased anxiety/depression. The book is easy to read, refreshing, and only about 140 pages or so in length. Many months ago someone from this site had recommended the book and I put off on buying it until I came across another post and said what the hell. It has changed my outlook on life and for the first time I think I'm in control of my thoughts rather than my thoughts being in control of me. The hardest part for me was to accept that they are just thoughts and to give them no attention and not talk back to them. Just let them go. Truly, give the book a try. It is definitely worth reading. Good luck and best wishes.
-
Guest
-
Guest
I know - I too these days am afraid I will act on my thoughts. Same boat!! I hate that. Because it's ridiculous - I worry about my family and myself ridiculously and here I am thinking what if I did something. And I always think "what if the zoloft makes me do it" but I did have these thoughts before I ever even took medicine so I know that they were there before. If you go up to 150 then make sure you do it in 25's. This recent increase hasn't been as bad because it was going up by 25. I have a friend who was on 150 and another who was on 200. So, I don't think that 150 is too much. I was on 100 last time and it worked well after several weeks. I might have to go there again one day. But I need to get used to 75 first. Let me know how your appt goes. Remember, I read somewhere in all of my obsessive research that people with these thoughts are actually LESS LIKELY than the general population of ever harming anyone or thing.
-
Guest
Yes I have been there!!! I actually bought and went through this program almost three years ago because my scary thoughts got to an all time low and I was afraid I was going to hurt/ kill my kids. I was convinced that I was psychotic because they were 10 and 11, not babies. I have had every crazy thought imaginable...from hurting/killing the people I love to fears of ramming into oncoming traffic, to fears of randomly hurting innocent people, to my food being drugged, to fears of allergic reactions...etc. etc. it goes on and on...the bottom line is that it is all just a product of an over tired over active mind. We are such intense people that we concentrate too much on every detail. you have to remember that everyone has had these thoughts we just cling to them and breed fear. I know that it is hard but with time and alot of practice you truly will overcome the fear and the thoughts stop hurting you.
Chrystal
Chrystal
-
Guest
Does anyone ever feel like they need to "test" themselves in certain situations to see if they'll "really hurt themselves or others?" And then freak out because you felt the need to test yourself??? I was cleaning house a few weeks ago and picked up a pin-I seriously though about poking myself with the pin - just to see - for whatever reason - and of course I'm analyzing all twenty different possibilities for why I might want to do this right now.
I then found myself sitting next to my daughter in bed last night watching her sleep - and of course I start thinking about hurting her...and I said to myself, "if you want to do this - do it." And of course I couldn't - I fastforwarded what would happen in my brain - and it made me sick and panicky - but I looked at that pillow and looked at her and thought - well - you could do this right now if you really wanted to. The fact that I never picked up the pillow and the fact that I got panicky afterwards is somewhat reassuring to me - but why are my OSTs moving towards this pattern of thinking now? Do other people feel the need to test themselves in certain situations? Do you freak yourself out even more for even thinking this way? Why am I so focused on my family - the people that I KNOW that I love and cannot live without??? Why is this happening now in my life? I never thought this way before. Why can't I have awful thoughts about people I despise??? I'm proud that I never acted on my thoughts or opportunities - but I am very uncomfortable about moving to this new line of thinking. Why is my brain making all of these awful leaps? Is this the precursor to something truly bad about to happen? I don't want to be at home because I'm afraid of wanting to hurt my family - but I don't want to leave because I love them and I would miss them terribly. It's like I'm in this weird middle ground right now where I'm afraid of death - but equally afraid of life.
How can we put closure on these thoughts and let them be done once and for all???
I then found myself sitting next to my daughter in bed last night watching her sleep - and of course I start thinking about hurting her...and I said to myself, "if you want to do this - do it." And of course I couldn't - I fastforwarded what would happen in my brain - and it made me sick and panicky - but I looked at that pillow and looked at her and thought - well - you could do this right now if you really wanted to. The fact that I never picked up the pillow and the fact that I got panicky afterwards is somewhat reassuring to me - but why are my OSTs moving towards this pattern of thinking now? Do other people feel the need to test themselves in certain situations? Do you freak yourself out even more for even thinking this way? Why am I so focused on my family - the people that I KNOW that I love and cannot live without??? Why is this happening now in my life? I never thought this way before. Why can't I have awful thoughts about people I despise??? I'm proud that I never acted on my thoughts or opportunities - but I am very uncomfortable about moving to this new line of thinking. Why is my brain making all of these awful leaps? Is this the precursor to something truly bad about to happen? I don't want to be at home because I'm afraid of wanting to hurt my family - but I don't want to leave because I love them and I would miss them terribly. It's like I'm in this weird middle ground right now where I'm afraid of death - but equally afraid of life.
How can we put closure on these thoughts and let them be done once and for all???
-
Guest
lars, tollymom, alicia, and anyone else with obsessive thoughts -
I too have had both scary and obsessive thoughts about all types of things. sometimes when I see a knife I will think what if I just grab it and slit my wrist or stab my boyfriend. I obsess a lot more about my social anxiety and about my relationships, though.
lars, I think you need to do some major stress relief. If your thoughts are getting scarier, I think it is a sign that you are majorly stressed and the most immediate and effective thing you can do is address that stress. exercise! I even incorporate self-talk mantras into my exercising. I do Tae-Bo and every time I kick, I say things like "I am strong", " I am healthy". I say it over and over on every single kick. Billy Blanks will say "Be in control of your work-out, don't let your work-out be in control of you" and in my mind or out loud I say "Be in control of your life [or thoughts], don't let your life [thoughts] be in control of you". This helps me blow off steam and feel energized and positive.
This may sound unhelpful or not specific to your problem, but I think your first task needs to be reducing your stress, however that may be. yoga is an excellent tool. you can also try meditation and/or prayer. or run..when I run I imagine pushing the anxiety out thru my feet with every step and I run hard because it proves to myself my WILL to get rid of this anxiety.
BELIEFS: Back to the obsessive thinking. Obsessive thinking has plagued me for years. I have been working on my anxiety for over 4 years now and there have been times that I made significant advances, but oftentimes I fall off the horse and seem to back-track and it is inevitably my obsessive thinking that derails me. The program says that when we obsess we are often avoiding something else that could cause us stress to deal with - like the need to be assertive with someone in our lives, or that we are in a bad relationship, or that we are avoiding some decision or something. I believe that, but what I wonder is why do we always return to the SAME scary thoughts. My scary thoughts may be different from yours, but the ones that I latch onto in an obsessive episode are always the same for me. Like I said I have had some scary violent thoughts, but for me they only provide me minimal concern. I obsess and can't seem to get rid of the thoughts associated with social anxiety - my biggest is eye contact. The interesting thing is that when you think about other people's fears, they may seem ridiculous or unfounded and it is hard to relate, but most likely other people feel the same about your fears. What is the difference? Why do I latch onto the eye contact thoughts but not the violent thoughts? Well, I can tell you why I don't latch onto the violent thoughts. My parents were very god-fearing and everything about the way they brought us up revolved around the bible and god. The result is that deep down, I believe that I am a good person. Please don't think that I am saying that religion is a prerequisite for believing you are a good person, 'cause I am not. I am only saying that my upbringing has instilled those thoughts in me from a very young age. Growing up, I never doubted that I was a good person and I definitely never had anyone tell me otherwise. I may think those violent thoughts, but it is easier for me to shake them off because deep down I KNOW that I would NEVER do them. On the other hand, I can't seem to shake the eye-contact thoughts and I can be stuck with them for weeks or months until they go away but usually come back the next time I am super stressed. Why these thoughts? I think it is because growing up my family moved a lot and we were involved in a non-mainstream church (that some called a cult). Growing up and going to public school, I was often the outsider. Nobody related to my experiences having gone to a family bible college and I was always the new person. So, deep down I don't believe that I am socially acceptable. Deep down, I don't believe that people like me or that I have very much control of whether or not they like me. I have no ingrained feeling of acceptance to fall back upon. That is why the social anxiety thoughts have so much power over me. SO, my point is that the obsessive thoughts that a person gets hooked on are the thoughts that hit the closest to home. PLEASE, don't think that I am implying that you are a violent/bad person. Because that is not what I am saying at all. I am saying that deep down, you question whether you are a good person. Perhaps, this is something that you have questioned your whole life or at least something that you have never felt strongly in the opposite direction.
The root of the problem is what we believe about ourselves which determines what we say about ourselves to ourselves and how we react to what others say about us AND TO OUR OWN THOUGHTS.
As adults, we can choose our beliefs and we can change them. The question is how? I mean what is a belief anyhow? I think it is something that directs our thoughts and actions in a specific area. For example, as a kid I remember hearing a noise or seeing something and thinking it might be a ghost....which was scary. But then I remembered - I don't believe in ghosts - and all of a sudden I was no longer scared. Because there is no such thing so there is nothing to be scared of and there must be some logical explanation for the noise/sound. So, my thoughts/feelings completely change based on my beliefs - the same situation could be scary or not at all scary. That is a simplistic example, but I think it proves the point.
I guess we have to work backwards by changing our thoughts and eventually we will have changed our beliefs. As someone that had scary violent thoughts, but believes deep down that I am a good person, I can tell you what I think when those violent thoughts surface. I think " I would NEVER do anything to hurt myself or others. It wouldn't matter if I thought that violent thought a million times, I would still never do it. There isn't anything that could possibly happen that could make me purposefully hurt myself or anyone else. And I KNOW this, beyond a shadow of a doubt. There is no room for doubt." I say it with conviction and I believe it and I know it and I own it. It's MY belief. Why don't you try using that self-talk next time you are thinking violent thoughts? You might think "how do I know that stuff is true just because I say it? it might not be true." But, you make it true. It's true because you say it is. and those scary thoughts - they mean nothing. They mean nothing because you say they mean nothing. They mean nothing because you give them no value. They mean nothing, they change nothing, they are nothing.
I hope you try out this self-talk and let me know if it helps you - I am confident that it will. Although, I wouldn't be surprised if you had to be very persistent with it. And eventually, you will change your belief in yourself so that you believe 100% that you are a good person and are in control of yourself and would never act out violently to hurt yourself or others. A thought is powerless against a belief.
So, perhaps we can trade self-talk. Is there anyone out there that can offer me some self-talk that can help me change my belief about my own social acceptance? When I am stressed, I obsess about whether I am making eye-contact too long or not long enough or inappropriately and I think so much about the eye contact that I am distracted from the conversation. I am afraid of looking at the person, I don't know why. It makes me anxious. I negatively anticipate every single interaction, especially with certain people that seem to bring this out in me. I feel that others can tell that I am anxious and are judging me. I am afraid to talk to people because I know they will look into my eyes and see the fear. My thoughts are pervasive and at work I am paranoid and think that people are purposefully excluding me and that they don't like me and are talking about me behind my back. I think these thoughts must stem from a belief or set of beliefs about myself. I could use some help in what to say to myself to change this. I don't have much experience in self or other acceptance.
caterpillar
I too have had both scary and obsessive thoughts about all types of things. sometimes when I see a knife I will think what if I just grab it and slit my wrist or stab my boyfriend. I obsess a lot more about my social anxiety and about my relationships, though.
lars, I think you need to do some major stress relief. If your thoughts are getting scarier, I think it is a sign that you are majorly stressed and the most immediate and effective thing you can do is address that stress. exercise! I even incorporate self-talk mantras into my exercising. I do Tae-Bo and every time I kick, I say things like "I am strong", " I am healthy". I say it over and over on every single kick. Billy Blanks will say "Be in control of your work-out, don't let your work-out be in control of you" and in my mind or out loud I say "Be in control of your life [or thoughts], don't let your life [thoughts] be in control of you". This helps me blow off steam and feel energized and positive.
This may sound unhelpful or not specific to your problem, but I think your first task needs to be reducing your stress, however that may be. yoga is an excellent tool. you can also try meditation and/or prayer. or run..when I run I imagine pushing the anxiety out thru my feet with every step and I run hard because it proves to myself my WILL to get rid of this anxiety.
BELIEFS: Back to the obsessive thinking. Obsessive thinking has plagued me for years. I have been working on my anxiety for over 4 years now and there have been times that I made significant advances, but oftentimes I fall off the horse and seem to back-track and it is inevitably my obsessive thinking that derails me. The program says that when we obsess we are often avoiding something else that could cause us stress to deal with - like the need to be assertive with someone in our lives, or that we are in a bad relationship, or that we are avoiding some decision or something. I believe that, but what I wonder is why do we always return to the SAME scary thoughts. My scary thoughts may be different from yours, but the ones that I latch onto in an obsessive episode are always the same for me. Like I said I have had some scary violent thoughts, but for me they only provide me minimal concern. I obsess and can't seem to get rid of the thoughts associated with social anxiety - my biggest is eye contact. The interesting thing is that when you think about other people's fears, they may seem ridiculous or unfounded and it is hard to relate, but most likely other people feel the same about your fears. What is the difference? Why do I latch onto the eye contact thoughts but not the violent thoughts? Well, I can tell you why I don't latch onto the violent thoughts. My parents were very god-fearing and everything about the way they brought us up revolved around the bible and god. The result is that deep down, I believe that I am a good person. Please don't think that I am saying that religion is a prerequisite for believing you are a good person, 'cause I am not. I am only saying that my upbringing has instilled those thoughts in me from a very young age. Growing up, I never doubted that I was a good person and I definitely never had anyone tell me otherwise. I may think those violent thoughts, but it is easier for me to shake them off because deep down I KNOW that I would NEVER do them. On the other hand, I can't seem to shake the eye-contact thoughts and I can be stuck with them for weeks or months until they go away but usually come back the next time I am super stressed. Why these thoughts? I think it is because growing up my family moved a lot and we were involved in a non-mainstream church (that some called a cult). Growing up and going to public school, I was often the outsider. Nobody related to my experiences having gone to a family bible college and I was always the new person. So, deep down I don't believe that I am socially acceptable. Deep down, I don't believe that people like me or that I have very much control of whether or not they like me. I have no ingrained feeling of acceptance to fall back upon. That is why the social anxiety thoughts have so much power over me. SO, my point is that the obsessive thoughts that a person gets hooked on are the thoughts that hit the closest to home. PLEASE, don't think that I am implying that you are a violent/bad person. Because that is not what I am saying at all. I am saying that deep down, you question whether you are a good person. Perhaps, this is something that you have questioned your whole life or at least something that you have never felt strongly in the opposite direction.
The root of the problem is what we believe about ourselves which determines what we say about ourselves to ourselves and how we react to what others say about us AND TO OUR OWN THOUGHTS.
As adults, we can choose our beliefs and we can change them. The question is how? I mean what is a belief anyhow? I think it is something that directs our thoughts and actions in a specific area. For example, as a kid I remember hearing a noise or seeing something and thinking it might be a ghost....which was scary. But then I remembered - I don't believe in ghosts - and all of a sudden I was no longer scared. Because there is no such thing so there is nothing to be scared of and there must be some logical explanation for the noise/sound. So, my thoughts/feelings completely change based on my beliefs - the same situation could be scary or not at all scary. That is a simplistic example, but I think it proves the point.
I guess we have to work backwards by changing our thoughts and eventually we will have changed our beliefs. As someone that had scary violent thoughts, but believes deep down that I am a good person, I can tell you what I think when those violent thoughts surface. I think " I would NEVER do anything to hurt myself or others. It wouldn't matter if I thought that violent thought a million times, I would still never do it. There isn't anything that could possibly happen that could make me purposefully hurt myself or anyone else. And I KNOW this, beyond a shadow of a doubt. There is no room for doubt." I say it with conviction and I believe it and I know it and I own it. It's MY belief. Why don't you try using that self-talk next time you are thinking violent thoughts? You might think "how do I know that stuff is true just because I say it? it might not be true." But, you make it true. It's true because you say it is. and those scary thoughts - they mean nothing. They mean nothing because you say they mean nothing. They mean nothing because you give them no value. They mean nothing, they change nothing, they are nothing.
I hope you try out this self-talk and let me know if it helps you - I am confident that it will. Although, I wouldn't be surprised if you had to be very persistent with it. And eventually, you will change your belief in yourself so that you believe 100% that you are a good person and are in control of yourself and would never act out violently to hurt yourself or others. A thought is powerless against a belief.
So, perhaps we can trade self-talk. Is there anyone out there that can offer me some self-talk that can help me change my belief about my own social acceptance? When I am stressed, I obsess about whether I am making eye-contact too long or not long enough or inappropriately and I think so much about the eye contact that I am distracted from the conversation. I am afraid of looking at the person, I don't know why. It makes me anxious. I negatively anticipate every single interaction, especially with certain people that seem to bring this out in me. I feel that others can tell that I am anxious and are judging me. I am afraid to talk to people because I know they will look into my eyes and see the fear. My thoughts are pervasive and at work I am paranoid and think that people are purposefully excluding me and that they don't like me and are talking about me behind my back. I think these thoughts must stem from a belief or set of beliefs about myself. I could use some help in what to say to myself to change this. I don't have much experience in self or other acceptance.
caterpillar
-
Guest
Well, regarding the eye contact. You can comfort yourself by thinking that they probably aren't even noticing that you are making eye contact. It's one of those natural things, like breathing, that just happens. Most people don't evaluate it and even though you are worrying about it and analyzing it, that doesn't mean they are. That reminds me of that story Lucinda tells so often about having an upset stomach and being so worried what others will think and when she shared a room with that lady the lady practically followed her into the bathroom and continued talking and she didn't even notice Lucinda had stomach problems. We are definitly making it worse and bigger than it is.
And I think you all are right that these things are a result of stress. I was doing really well, hadn't had a thought at all lately and if I did see a knife, I'd just move on and not even think the same old thoughts. But this week my six year old had to go in the hospital for pneumonia. I was emotional, but strong, while she was in the hospital knowing that I had to make sure she was okay and comfort her becuase she didn't like being there at all. Of course the minute we get back home and all is well... I start obsessing and having scary thoughts about knives, hurting myself, others, etc... Now think about that for a minute. I was terrified that my daughter was ill and in the hospital and so scared that she wouldn't be okay... and then all's well and I get home and make myself start thinking scarey thoughts about knives, etc... I think that just goes to show us all that it is related to anxiety and stress... Her hospitalization was one of the most stressful times ever for me, and once all was well, I found a way to divert myself into the same old pattern of obsessive thoughts. I'm just going to try positive self talk, exercise and stick with the program. We do this to ourselves, why, I don't know, but I don't want to do this forever and we WILL get over this!!
And I think you all are right that these things are a result of stress. I was doing really well, hadn't had a thought at all lately and if I did see a knife, I'd just move on and not even think the same old thoughts. But this week my six year old had to go in the hospital for pneumonia. I was emotional, but strong, while she was in the hospital knowing that I had to make sure she was okay and comfort her becuase she didn't like being there at all. Of course the minute we get back home and all is well... I start obsessing and having scary thoughts about knives, hurting myself, others, etc... Now think about that for a minute. I was terrified that my daughter was ill and in the hospital and so scared that she wouldn't be okay... and then all's well and I get home and make myself start thinking scarey thoughts about knives, etc... I think that just goes to show us all that it is related to anxiety and stress... Her hospitalization was one of the most stressful times ever for me, and once all was well, I found a way to divert myself into the same old pattern of obsessive thoughts. I'm just going to try positive self talk, exercise and stick with the program. We do this to ourselves, why, I don't know, but I don't want to do this forever and we WILL get over this!!