I debated a lot about posting about this here, but I decided to go ahead with it anyhow to see if anyone had any ideas/suggestions or could share similar stories that I could potentially relate to about what is happening with my panic disorder.
I've been in the throws of anxiety/panic disorder/agoraphobia for nearly 4 years now. I've experienced bouts of anxiety and even panic attacks since I can remember, but they never persisted more than a few weeks to a month before sort of fading out without my having to do much of anything.
I believe that my anxiety this time around was onset by an extremely stressful and emotional time in my life and the circumstances surrounding that. At first, like many I was unaware that I was having panic attacks and got a thorough workup of my health to discover nothing was wrong with my physically besides my physical symptoms.
I tried buspar and lexapro -- without any significant improvements. I gained a ton of weight on lexapro, so that was just another negative for me.
I found the program and purchased it right away and worked through it diligently. I've since done the program 2 more times and I've also seen two different therapists and am on my third. I'm not quite as bad as where I was - but every day I swing back and forth between bad and worse - if you know what I mean.
I don't know why, despite my best efforts I cannot seem to get to a functioning place again in my life.
My main fears are passing out, choking, and dying. These fears can come in groups (along w/their symptoms) or they can come in waves where I won't have one symptom for a while only for it to rear it's ugly head when I least expect it. The chronic dizziness, and choking sensations bother me the worst.
I don't hyperventilate, so that's not a factor in my dizziness. I talk positively to myself but my physical symptoms come so fast, furious, and are so intense that no matter what coping skills I use I feel that I simply cannot help myself. If I am at home, I just try to ride it out - but that is a lot more difficult to do out in public or at a store when I need to be concentrating.
I want my life back, I want to function, have a job, finish school -- be HAPPY again.
What do you do when you feel you've tried it all and nothing's making the difference? Can anyone relate at all?
I'm truly not coming from a negative place here - I'm just trying to figure out what I can do to improve and get better when the seemingly normal avenues haven't helped for some reason or another.
What to do when you feel you've tried it all?
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Guest
Hi,
I can definitely understand your frustration. I know just 3 years ago, I felt that I had tried it all, and I never dreamed that I would be doing as well as I am now. I am not 100%, but I have a constant stressor with a son with severe autism, so I have learned not to be hard on myself, and just very proud of how far I've come.
Here are just a few suggestions from me that may help you get "unstuck".
First of all, it's very important to separate your self-worth from your performance with panic disorder. When you learn to love yourself, and just accept yourself where you are at, you really do quit keeping score about your performance, and you just learn to relax. For me, my source of unconditional love came when I realized that God loved me no matter whether or not I did well in conquering my disorder, or I couldn't leave the drive way. When I tied my performance against panic disorder to receiving love or making a difference in this world, that was way too much pressure. When I realized the truth that God love me at my worst and that I make a difference just by being alive:), it just set me free.
Secondly, please understand the nature of adrenaline, and its long term effects on the body. It depends on the severity of your condition, but the longer adrenaline has been activated in your body, the longer it takes to get it out of your system, for your adrenal gland to heal, etc. Think of your adrenal gland as a pipe that has burst. When you do this program and other anxiety relieving techniques, you patch the hole in the pipe, but you've still got the flooded water(the adrenaline) inside of you. The flooded water has also changed your brain chemistry, etc. You have to find a way to let the flooded water drain out of you and know that when you have a symptom of anxiety that it's just the flooded water causing it. If you don't handle that right, you will tell your adrenal gland to produce more adrenaline which is the last thing you need. There are so many analogies including that your body is experiencing aftershocks and not the original earth quake or that your body is a race car that has been going 90 to nothing and now you have suddenly slammed on the breaks. You've stopped moving, but your engine is still extremely hot, and you need to give it time to cool off. Just because the engine is still hot doesn't mean you're still speeding.
I think books that explain that well are definitely books by Claire Weeks. Most are out of print, but you can look on Amazon.com. You've done this program, and I bet it has helped but when your body reacts to the leftover adrenaline, you are thinking that you are at square one, and you're not. Let me repeat, you are not at square one:). I really think it would be good to read a book called, "The Anxiety Cure". I don't agree with all of the information in the book, but I definitely think the author is on to something with his chapter on Adrenal Fatigue. I think it's worth getting just for that. After years of constant trauma in my life, I just developed adrenal fatigue which meant that my adrenal gland actually enlarged to compensate for the chronic stress. When I realized that I needed to lower the stress in my life, that I needed lots of rest, exercise and relaxation and relaxing activities without beating myself up for being an unproductive failure, it really helped me to start healing. Also, I can't overemphasize regular exercise and drinking plenty of water to rid your body of the excess adrenaline. It may not be a magic pill, and it could take a year or more to really get it all out, but after four years of regular exercise, I can say without a doubt that it has completely changed my brain chemistry, gotten rid of the built up adrenaline, and now my body handles adrenaline better,etc.
Finally, I know you say you've been to therapy, and it just depends on what type of therapist you have, etc. I can honestly say that I've had times where I've just wasted a year or more with the wrong therapist because I was so dependent and afraid and the therapist had terrible boundaries. In other words, what I thought was helping me made me worse. I don't know what you've been through in your life, but the issue of boundaries played a big role in my life and was a key to my healing. Boundaries are important to protect ourselves in our relationships with others, in forming our identities, in how we treat ourselves, etc. I think the concept of boundaries is something that many of us underestimate as a path to healing. It seems completely unrelated to anxiety, but I've found that it's a core or underlying issue, and anxiety is often a symptom of having poor boundaries. So, for therapy, please make sure you find someone who has great boundaries. That may be hard to find until you know more about healthy boundaries. Two books I recommend are "Boundaries: Where You End and I Begin" and "Boundaries" by Dr. Henry Cloud and Townsend.
Finally, I don't know what you've been through in your life, but please consider that if you are a survivor of abuse, that you may have grief issues. I do believe that cognitive therapy plays an important role in healing. However, I also believe that it is important to acknowledge the truth about our feelings and unresolved grief. There is a time to grieve. I don't know your religious beliefs, but if you are a Christian, you are told to grieve, "but not as one who has no hope." To me, that means that there are times to be sad in life, to acknowledge pain and express it healthily, however, we don't get stuck in grief forever and let it keep us from living a happy life. Most people are afraid of grief. They are afraid that they will get stuck there if they start to grieve, but if you are at a place where you can acknowledge the truth about grieving, you will not get stuck there. It's not grieving at all that usually keeps us stuck in anxiety, depression, etc. It's a way to avoid facing what we need to face. I think what matters more than anything is facing the truth. So, I highly recommend a therapist who is trained in grief, trauma, abuse issues, etc. if that is what you have dealt with in your past. These therapists tend to have an eclectic approach.
I hope something I said helps, and I know not everything I have said will apply to you. If you really feel like you've done everything, I just think that you have to give yourself more time. Dr. Cloud and Townsend also have another book about healing that would be good to read, and they say that the components of healing are time, truth, and grace. The book is called, "Changes that Heal". That book really helped me as well.
Take care,
luvpiggy
I can definitely understand your frustration. I know just 3 years ago, I felt that I had tried it all, and I never dreamed that I would be doing as well as I am now. I am not 100%, but I have a constant stressor with a son with severe autism, so I have learned not to be hard on myself, and just very proud of how far I've come.
Here are just a few suggestions from me that may help you get "unstuck".
First of all, it's very important to separate your self-worth from your performance with panic disorder. When you learn to love yourself, and just accept yourself where you are at, you really do quit keeping score about your performance, and you just learn to relax. For me, my source of unconditional love came when I realized that God loved me no matter whether or not I did well in conquering my disorder, or I couldn't leave the drive way. When I tied my performance against panic disorder to receiving love or making a difference in this world, that was way too much pressure. When I realized the truth that God love me at my worst and that I make a difference just by being alive:), it just set me free.
Secondly, please understand the nature of adrenaline, and its long term effects on the body. It depends on the severity of your condition, but the longer adrenaline has been activated in your body, the longer it takes to get it out of your system, for your adrenal gland to heal, etc. Think of your adrenal gland as a pipe that has burst. When you do this program and other anxiety relieving techniques, you patch the hole in the pipe, but you've still got the flooded water(the adrenaline) inside of you. The flooded water has also changed your brain chemistry, etc. You have to find a way to let the flooded water drain out of you and know that when you have a symptom of anxiety that it's just the flooded water causing it. If you don't handle that right, you will tell your adrenal gland to produce more adrenaline which is the last thing you need. There are so many analogies including that your body is experiencing aftershocks and not the original earth quake or that your body is a race car that has been going 90 to nothing and now you have suddenly slammed on the breaks. You've stopped moving, but your engine is still extremely hot, and you need to give it time to cool off. Just because the engine is still hot doesn't mean you're still speeding.
I think books that explain that well are definitely books by Claire Weeks. Most are out of print, but you can look on Amazon.com. You've done this program, and I bet it has helped but when your body reacts to the leftover adrenaline, you are thinking that you are at square one, and you're not. Let me repeat, you are not at square one:). I really think it would be good to read a book called, "The Anxiety Cure". I don't agree with all of the information in the book, but I definitely think the author is on to something with his chapter on Adrenal Fatigue. I think it's worth getting just for that. After years of constant trauma in my life, I just developed adrenal fatigue which meant that my adrenal gland actually enlarged to compensate for the chronic stress. When I realized that I needed to lower the stress in my life, that I needed lots of rest, exercise and relaxation and relaxing activities without beating myself up for being an unproductive failure, it really helped me to start healing. Also, I can't overemphasize regular exercise and drinking plenty of water to rid your body of the excess adrenaline. It may not be a magic pill, and it could take a year or more to really get it all out, but after four years of regular exercise, I can say without a doubt that it has completely changed my brain chemistry, gotten rid of the built up adrenaline, and now my body handles adrenaline better,etc.
Finally, I know you say you've been to therapy, and it just depends on what type of therapist you have, etc. I can honestly say that I've had times where I've just wasted a year or more with the wrong therapist because I was so dependent and afraid and the therapist had terrible boundaries. In other words, what I thought was helping me made me worse. I don't know what you've been through in your life, but the issue of boundaries played a big role in my life and was a key to my healing. Boundaries are important to protect ourselves in our relationships with others, in forming our identities, in how we treat ourselves, etc. I think the concept of boundaries is something that many of us underestimate as a path to healing. It seems completely unrelated to anxiety, but I've found that it's a core or underlying issue, and anxiety is often a symptom of having poor boundaries. So, for therapy, please make sure you find someone who has great boundaries. That may be hard to find until you know more about healthy boundaries. Two books I recommend are "Boundaries: Where You End and I Begin" and "Boundaries" by Dr. Henry Cloud and Townsend.
Finally, I don't know what you've been through in your life, but please consider that if you are a survivor of abuse, that you may have grief issues. I do believe that cognitive therapy plays an important role in healing. However, I also believe that it is important to acknowledge the truth about our feelings and unresolved grief. There is a time to grieve. I don't know your religious beliefs, but if you are a Christian, you are told to grieve, "but not as one who has no hope." To me, that means that there are times to be sad in life, to acknowledge pain and express it healthily, however, we don't get stuck in grief forever and let it keep us from living a happy life. Most people are afraid of grief. They are afraid that they will get stuck there if they start to grieve, but if you are at a place where you can acknowledge the truth about grieving, you will not get stuck there. It's not grieving at all that usually keeps us stuck in anxiety, depression, etc. It's a way to avoid facing what we need to face. I think what matters more than anything is facing the truth. So, I highly recommend a therapist who is trained in grief, trauma, abuse issues, etc. if that is what you have dealt with in your past. These therapists tend to have an eclectic approach.
I hope something I said helps, and I know not everything I have said will apply to you. If you really feel like you've done everything, I just think that you have to give yourself more time. Dr. Cloud and Townsend also have another book about healing that would be good to read, and they say that the components of healing are time, truth, and grace. The book is called, "Changes that Heal". That book really helped me as well.
Take care,
luvpiggy
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Guest
Thank you so much for your thoughtful and detailed response, I REALLY do appreciate it! Speaking of the adrenal as flooded water really put that into perspective for me, because I do feel as if I am just swimming in adrenaline constantly regardless of how much I try to stay calm.
I do have some of Claire Weeks books along with just about every panic and anxiety book there is out there
.
The past two months I have been working out and eating right, so maybe I will soon start to see a difference with my adrenaline.
I'm really glad that you're feeling better and doing so well!
I do have some of Claire Weeks books along with just about every panic and anxiety book there is out there
.The past two months I have been working out and eating right, so maybe I will soon start to see a difference with my adrenaline.
I'm really glad that you're feeling better and doing so well!
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Guest
Luvpiggy -
Excellent post! I agree with everything you said. I love Dr. Clouds books and highly recommend them too. Thanks for taking the time to help.
Anxiousk -
I have asked myself many times "why can't I find the answer to this? I am doing everything that I should be doing...therapy, meds, books, relaxation." All I can tell you is that I believe if you persevere through it all, then healing will come. Remember "healing is not an event but a process". Think about that.
I honestly believe this and wanted to share it with you.
God Bless.
Excellent post! I agree with everything you said. I love Dr. Clouds books and highly recommend them too. Thanks for taking the time to help.
Anxiousk -
I have asked myself many times "why can't I find the answer to this? I am doing everything that I should be doing...therapy, meds, books, relaxation." All I can tell you is that I believe if you persevere through it all, then healing will come. Remember "healing is not an event but a process". Think about that.
I honestly believe this and wanted to share it with you.
God Bless.
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Guest
AnxiousK - I just wanted to add a few things to the wonderful and powerful information you have already received.
Are you allowing the sensations, the fears, the thoughts to be there when they show up? I mean truly allowing. You open your arms up and say, "OK, wash over me. Do your worst. I can handle it." Do you do that? Because the more you do this the faster anxiety will pass. The more you do this, the sooner you can move on with your day. "Ok, I had that brief attack. So what. It's over and I handled it. Now I'm continuing on with my day." "OK, I had that moment of fear of choking. It's over. I handled it. I'm moving on with my day." "Ok, I had that fear of dying. It's past. I handled it. I'm moving on with my day." "I feel dizzy, but I know I can function with it." When you change your attitude toward what you are experiencing it does indeed go away quickly. You stop fearing if it will return. It doesn't matter if it comes back because YOU WILL HANDLE IT. When you get to this point, and you will, you will experience these fears and symptoms less and less and less. In time you will be dismissing them without any effort at all.
Healing from anxiety does not mean you will never have it again. It means you know what to do when it comes. It means you are no longer afraid of it. It means you dismiss it as quickly as it comes.
Your fears are not unusual. Life is a risk and we have to acknowledge that in order to move on. The chances of those things we fear happening are very remote. Dying will come some day, but not today. Choking can occur but if it does you and your body can handle it. Dizziness occurs with anxiety but you have not died from it. I'm not trying to be cold and callus. I have experienced all of these fears (and many more). If you want to stop being afraid you must stop avoiding. I recommend exposure therapy to help you reach your goal.
Many good books have been recommended to you. The following is from a doctor who himself was phobic and has "cured". Freedom from fear, by Dr. Howard Liebgold. It's the best book I have found to help me understand and work through my fears. It's a process, be patient. You can heal from all this. Read what has been suggested and pick out what "calls out" to you. One door opens another door so do not be concerned with which to start with. Just start. The rest will follow.
You have received excellent information on this thread. It all works!!!
Are you allowing the sensations, the fears, the thoughts to be there when they show up? I mean truly allowing. You open your arms up and say, "OK, wash over me. Do your worst. I can handle it." Do you do that? Because the more you do this the faster anxiety will pass. The more you do this, the sooner you can move on with your day. "Ok, I had that brief attack. So what. It's over and I handled it. Now I'm continuing on with my day." "OK, I had that moment of fear of choking. It's over. I handled it. I'm moving on with my day." "Ok, I had that fear of dying. It's past. I handled it. I'm moving on with my day." "I feel dizzy, but I know I can function with it." When you change your attitude toward what you are experiencing it does indeed go away quickly. You stop fearing if it will return. It doesn't matter if it comes back because YOU WILL HANDLE IT. When you get to this point, and you will, you will experience these fears and symptoms less and less and less. In time you will be dismissing them without any effort at all.
Healing from anxiety does not mean you will never have it again. It means you know what to do when it comes. It means you are no longer afraid of it. It means you dismiss it as quickly as it comes.
Your fears are not unusual. Life is a risk and we have to acknowledge that in order to move on. The chances of those things we fear happening are very remote. Dying will come some day, but not today. Choking can occur but if it does you and your body can handle it. Dizziness occurs with anxiety but you have not died from it. I'm not trying to be cold and callus. I have experienced all of these fears (and many more). If you want to stop being afraid you must stop avoiding. I recommend exposure therapy to help you reach your goal.
Many good books have been recommended to you. The following is from a doctor who himself was phobic and has "cured". Freedom from fear, by Dr. Howard Liebgold. It's the best book I have found to help me understand and work through my fears. It's a process, be patient. You can heal from all this. Read what has been suggested and pick out what "calls out" to you. One door opens another door so do not be concerned with which to start with. Just start. The rest will follow.
You have received excellent information on this thread. It all works!!!
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Guest
Boon - thanks for your response also!
I am not so much in the avoidance phase anymore - I try just about everything but I usually do not "go it alone" still at this point. I do sometimes run out of places because of the panic, it doesn't always happen - more often than not I can work through it.
I'd love to be able to tell my anxiety to do it's worst and not be afraid - but that's where I struggle. I do NOT know how to get to that point where I'm not scared about the symptoms. I know it isn't a disease, I recognize it's anxiety -- but the fear of choking or fainting is running so deep with me that I never feel I successfully can say - bring it on.
I am not so much in the avoidance phase anymore - I try just about everything but I usually do not "go it alone" still at this point. I do sometimes run out of places because of the panic, it doesn't always happen - more often than not I can work through it.
I'd love to be able to tell my anxiety to do it's worst and not be afraid - but that's where I struggle. I do NOT know how to get to that point where I'm not scared about the symptoms. I know it isn't a disease, I recognize it's anxiety -- but the fear of choking or fainting is running so deep with me that I never feel I successfully can say - bring it on.