One More Step

SeaRunner · Post by **SeaRunner** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 4:10 am

Beranger -

As I think you already know, I went through a divorce as well. I am so sorry you had to go through all of that before the marriage even occurred. At least you found out that things were not going to work out before you got into too deep like having children. But you clearly came out of that time with a stronger self identity and self belief. Those are such valuable traits.

As for perfection, I don't know exactly what we are trying to accomplish. Perhaps it's rooted in the fear of failure. If we do everything perfectly, then we can't fail, right? Wrong! As you and Ninja have already pointed out, there is no way to be perfect. It's an illusion.

That's not to say we shouldn't try our best. We just need to learn to set limits and know when good is good enough. We'll be much happier in the long run. Just ask yourself, if you've actually attained perfection in some area of your life, but are miserable because of it, was it worth it? I think the answer is pretty clear. On a side note, I just read Ninja's second post on the subject and realized I must repeated much of what he said. I guess we tend to think alike!

Jamie

SeaRunner · Post by **SeaRunner** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 4:18 am

NinjaMike -

I think that's a great idea to do a refresher course and will definitely be joining you. I just finished putting all of the CD's on my MP3 player and am ready to dive back into the material.

I'm curious what new things we'll see that that we may have missed the first (or last) time. It may be a single sentence here or there or some new subtlety that we overlooked. Whatever the case, it can only help to hone our skills and sharpen our minds. Plus we now have the advantage of our life experiences that have occurred between now and the last time we went through the Program.

Here we go again,
Jamie

NinjaFrodo · Post by **NinjaFrodo** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 4:42 am

Ha NinjaMike.

I agree with everything you said. What ideas will pop up this time? What things will click or which lightbulbs will go off in our heads? I think the lesson on obsessive thoughts will be very interesting this time around. Especially the part where they say to change these obsessive thoughts into something funny. Or life experiences between now and the first time we went through the program for some of us anyways. Hey i might actually bust out some of my old spiral notepads and post some of my old negative thoughts. I think i'm up to 8-10 spiral notepads full of thoughts now.

Mike

SeaRunner · Post by **SeaRunner** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 4:59 am

Sure, NinjaMike sounds good to me! I could call you Mr. Frodo if you prefer.

Yikes! Ten notebooks of negative thoughts? You should see if the StressCenter.com can put them in some sort of archive!

I was rereading the Guidebook that comes with Session 2 last night. One sentence jumped out at me. I realize that not everyone has the same version of the Program as I do so you may not be able to see this, but the point is still the same.

Buried in an inconspicuous little paragraph at the bottom of page 2-5 is what I think is the most important lesson in the entire Program. It's also the only place I've seen it written out explicitly (so far). Specifically, the sentence reads "...the only way to stop fearing panic and anxiety attacks is to experience them." I'm a true believer that this is the most powerful idea in fighting anxiety and panic.

I'm sure there are many more treasures like this one to be be unearthed. Let's get digging...

Jamie

NinjaFrodo · Post by **NinjaFrodo** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 6:31 am

Whatever you want to call me is fine by me.

I am pretty open but i'm not that open to sharing my thoughts.

Yes that is still the same in my program. This is true but at the same time you need the skills before you face it or else you will continue to face it and it may even get worse (which is what i found in some situations and it got better in others). This was not something that you were aware of last time?

I'm sure there will be many more. Typically i get my new information when i go and do a search on both Carolyn Dickman's posts as well as BakedPears.

Mike

forever young 06 · Post by **forever young 06** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 9:14 am

searunner,
I love your post. you are so kind and reply to everyone that post on here. I admire your courage as working on facing your fears you are trying so hard and I believe you will succeed it is determination that will get you there.

I need to start working harder at facing my fears I had been doing a little probably not enough.I have gotten my program out and listened to tape 2 and looked at the book it is good to refresh on the program. we need to learn to not be afraid of the panic we need to fell it and do it anyway . But I don't wnat to I need to find the courage. first I need to know what I want there is some soul searching here you see I am refusing to face anything and at this time I don't know what I want. Maybe I need to start with you all but am afraid I won't finish

SeaRunner · Post by **SeaRunner** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 11:38 am

Mike -

Of course. I was just teasing about publishing your journals. I know I wouldn't want anyone reading my journal either. I was just amazed that you had so much recorded. You certainly are dedicated to have generated so much material.

You're correct in that having the skills to deal with anxiety as it happens is very important. But having the skills is not enough. If we never face our fears, never take risks, never push our boundaries, then we can't expect to progress much from where we are right now.

Yes, I was aware of the concept, in fact for many years prior to ever starting the program. But this was the first time I noticed it explicitly printed word for word in the guidebook. I think it's such an important concept to recovery that I wish it were emphasized much more.

How do you search other peoples' posts without bringing up everything they've ever posted? Is there an advanced search somewhere?

Jamie

SeaRunner · Post by **SeaRunner** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 11:46 am

FY06 -

Thanks for the kudos. I kind of feel like the host of this thread since I started it and feel like I should reply to anyone who is generous enough to share their thoughts. But I appreciate your kind words.

I hope you're right. I've struggled for over two decades and I'm ready to be rid of this beast. I know that recovery comes slowly and I can be impatient, but I know that I can't stay where I am now. This is not the life I want to lead. There's too much I've given up to accommodate false fears and untrue beliefs.

I'm glad you're looking back over the Program material. It's also encouraging that you want to put more effort into pushing yourself and facing your fears. I certainly understand your hesitation as I have the same feelings. I suppose that you will know what to do when the time comes. My guess is that you will eventually hit a point where the pain of staying in your current situation becomes worse than that of dealing with your anxiety.

Feel free to join us in going through the Program again. Don't worry about whether you finish or not. It's not a race and you're not being judged. One thing I can guarantee you though: if you never start, you definitely won't finish. At least by trying you have the opportunity to make it all the way through.

Jamie

THH · Post by **THH** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 2:31 pm

Hi everyone. Its been a busy week for me too. That is a good thing.

One thing I have come to realize is for me, and maybe others too, when it comes to realationships we ( either the guy or girl ) Have to remain true to our selves first. I have to be the best me I can. For sure someone with anxiety/ depression can take it way to far.( I'm speaking of myself,) But I think it is healthy to have a life not totaly depentant on our spouse but a little thing we each have of our own. Do our own thing with out the help of the other. You can still do things together and it helps make that time more special.So many times when you hear of peoples relationships break up we almost seam paralyzed buy the event. Its hard and emotional but it makes you think if we stayed dependent on ourselves maybe we would do better in general. We would have the faith in our selves that we "can do this".
Berengar, My heart goes out to you. I think you had to see what a strong independent women you are. Remember how you felt, and you pulled your self up to go on. That takes guts!

And like Searunner says, just think if you went forward for years and then had to do it. You can go on...
I'm going to redo the program too. I have a more current program so we can compare whats changed. I'll look in my work book to see if that is still in my session 2.
SeaRunner, The fear of fear is a big idea for me. I actually caught myself thinking of what if thoughts way into the future, to the point I realized it was not even close to reality. That was a large moment for myself. At that time I was able to reconize exactlly what I was doing to myself, and make a joke to my self and it was like pulling the plug on the whole anxiety attack. Then it becomes empowering. I'm glad you going to go though the program too. You are doing well working with yourself in a calm way, keeping sight of your goal and giving yourself permission to be human. You will one day make your goal!

SeaRunner · Post by **SeaRunner** » Mon Sep 06, 2010 3:33 pm

THH -

There is a happy medium to be found with relationships. On one extreme, you have some relationships where both partners are extremely independent with nearly separate lives and there is little to no relationship at all. On the other extreme you have relationships where both partners are so involved that they lose themselves and the relationship itself becomes bigger than either partner. Neither of those cases is a good model for a relationship. A good balance between personal time and relationship time is typically the most healthy.

That being said, some people try to protect themselves from being hurt by never truly opening up with their partner. In that case, there is a fear of intimacy and lack of trust. That weakens the foundation of the relationship and also is something to be avoided. So be sure when being apart you are doing it for the right reasons.

Changing subjects, you did really well with recognizing that your fears were getting completely out of sync with reality. The fact that you both realized what you were doing and were able to then stop the thinking process is a big accomplishment. This is one of those moments you will want to remember so you can draw on it during future times of stress and anxiety. Being able to see past the immediate feelings, body sensations, and worries is a huge step in overcoming anxiety.

Also, I'm glad I'm joining up with you and Mike too. I'm looking forward to seeing what more we can learn and how we might better apply what we have already been practicing.

Jamie