Empowering Group Program Run-through Part2

[Ninjafrodo2]

Yay we all made it through lesson 1!
To recap we had just started our journey...we started to look at the symptoms we were experiencing with the anxiety and depression. We were focusing on our starting point with our journey of change, looking at the limitations, the fears we have, the struggles we've experienced, the triggering moments as starting to form goals for the efforts we are putting forth.


We are now starting lesson 2, the beginning skills of our new ways of handling anxiety, stress and struggles. So lets get started!





Mike

[forever young 06]

good morning all. I listened to session 2 yesterday. It seems like it makes me a little nervous. I heard Jackie say, once you told me it was just anxiety I felt so much better or something to that effect and I tought why couldn't I feel that way. when I found out that's what it was it didn't go away. I had developed the avoidance behavior so strong I though I had to do that to stay sane. I have a lot to learn I see. I always compared myself to other people. I didn't get to write in my journal yesterday need to do that right now. I had my daughter and her family out for supper last night so was busy. I am supposed to go to her house tonight to keep her kids while they go to bingo. I may have to move my night writing up a little early on those nights.

[THH]

Good morning everyone.

I read part of lesson 2 last night. I agree that it caused me to feel anxious too. I was anxious before I started this program again and 1 & 2 have produced some anxiety in me as well. It also says that this is normal. It causes me to look at myself and that is stressful!
Life is stressful.

I think I am going to set my relaxation tape up so n the morning when I wake up I will play it. I'll see how this works for me.

Have a good day everyone.

[coachchris]

Lesson 2 really helped to understand my body and get my power and control back. I can remember having adrenalin at a very young age, and I was always the one in the bathroom with IBS or hyperventilating at the dentist. Looking back I didn't know it was adrenalin I was just trying to survive the moment. Now that I understand it's a hormone and that I have a lot of power to think better and feel better it doesn't scare me anymore. If I have adrenalin now, it alerts me to change my thinking, slow myself down and check-in with my spiritual life. If your adrenalin level is over a 5 (on a scale from 1-10 with 10 being the highest) it's going be difficult to manage your thoughts well. Once you can get the adrenalin levels lower then you will really begin to think better and feel better. Remember to use your relaxation cd twice daily, under-react the best you can to EVERYTHING, minimize your stimulants and drink your water. Light exercise will also bring those levels down. PM me if you need more help in this area.

You are safe! You have a healthy body and a healthy mind.
Coach Chris

[THH]

Coach Chris,
THNAK YOU!
This helps me- When your adrenalin levels are over 5 it is difficult to manage. I totally know when I must be there as I can't seam to make sense out of things. Then I worry how am I ever going to break though all this if I can't understand. Which is the wrong way to feel. I need to take a break and do some exercise and know it is not going to just go away instantly and there is a process that I must learn so I can accept the way I feel and not fear it.

Oh do I know about surviving the moment! LOL... Me too.

I do want to be in control of my life again, I know I can. I made good improvements and had better perspective on things.

I also liked your reminder of the connection with spiritual life as well. I have always liked the serenity prayer. For anyone who may not know it:
God, Grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, Courage to change the things I can. And the wisdom to know the difference. Amen!

[Ninjafrodo2]

I really like how the posts and the conversation are flowing smoothly this time around and I really appreciate how CoachChris is in on this too! This run through has already been alot more effective and smoother than any of the other ones that I've done with people on this forum. I think it also helps that I stopped trying to be the leader and stopped trying to respond to every single topic that people brought up in their posts. I am still reading everything that is posted unless it is directed towards another person.

I feel just like everybody else in this thread, when I got into lesson 2 and I was listening to the cd, my initial reaction before the anxiety was "NO!" followed by "I can't do that, its tooo hard, its impossible" and that itself caused me alot of anxiety. The idea of facing these sensations is terrifying for me but I realized from last week when I got triggered by many different things, the first thing that happened was a "NO!" and then I felt extremely overwhelmed and even though I was trying to accept it, I think the "no" was still keeping me stuck in it.

This actually reminds me of something I learned in a Mindfulness CBT group that I was apart of. We learned about a buddhist writing that was called the Second Arrow. In it they talk about the first arrow being the pain (the external event or the external stressor) and if we respond with resistance (denial, pushing away, avoiding, judging) then its like being hit with another arrow and it actually makes the pain from the original situation feel even worse! And in group one day I did have some kind of physical pain come up and I decided to test this out. What I noticed was I could experience the physical pain, accept and allow it and then even though it was there, I was able to feel calm and peaceful but uncomfortable at the same time, it was really amazing. The one facilitator even showed us something that was really remarkable....he said resistance is like when you make a fist with one arm and you use the other arm to squeeze hard just below the elbow (on the forearm) and it hurts....and acceptance and allowing is like opening the hand up and doing the same thing and it doesn't end up hurting.

There was also a situation when I went to Cuba last year...I have a fear of heights and I have never been in a plane before and I'd never been to an airport before either or to another contenent. Well I got on the airplane and was feeling pretty good and I wasn't even thinking about what the take off would be like until we were just about to take off, and then I started to get really really anxious, I'd say I was at about a 9 or 10 right off the bat but I sat with it, I allowed myself to express my nervousness (it was very obvious and my friend's friends both recognized it and commented on it), I allowed myself to be present with it and after we fully ascended in the air I was fine and then I was enjoying the rest of the trip (it also helped that there was a toddler who kept throwing his pacifier at me from the seat behind me and funny enough he stopped and fell asleep as soon as my anxiety and the ascending stopped). I got through it and the interesting thing was, is that I didn't have any anxiety at all when we took the plane back home...that was my first plane anxiety and my last it seemed.

So I see the initial situation coming up and the initial spike of anxiety feelings, the feeling of immediate heat, the strong heart beat, the sudden shallow breathing...and thats when I can say yes or no....because I find the initial situation and the initial NO to that seem to happen so fast that I can't stop it at that moment but anything after that I am able to make a choice...although its not always that simple.


Forever young
The part when Jackie stated that once Lucinda told her that what she was having was a panic attack it lifted the weight of her shoulders and she felt much better.....when I first used this program 9 years ago, I felt really relieved too but that doesn't mean it just went away for me and it still doesn't mean it went away for me...it just lessened it and thats how I take it when she said what she said on the tape. I still have an incredible avoidance to it, the feelings are still strong and I know whats going on as it goes on but its still a big struggle for me. Habit is much stronger than reason.


As for the tape...a few things jumped out at me....Carolyn said you can use the very same 6 steps for panic as you do for generalized anxiety and what-if thinking. Thats something I resonate with and feel is what I need to be doign right now.

Dr.Fischer also said its really hard to give yourself to another person if you can't get ahold of your thoughts and feelings and that jumped out at me as well.



Mike

[Ninjafrodo2]

This lesson has caused alot of anxiety for me already and it makes me think of when I do face my limitations and I feel terrified but I'm letting myself know that I am taking it slowly and doing it gradually....I don't have to face my limitations right now, I'm not trying to create extra anxiety or panic attacks, I'm just working with what is already in my life and presence at the moment and thats going to come regardless because it does come up everyday so I can either continue to suffering with it over and over and over and struggle mnore and more or I can start to face it and I can gain my power and my confidence back...either way they are going to continue coming whether I deny, push them away or whatever.


Oh and I learned this exercise from a book I read a few months ago that helps to get comfortable with the "unknown". When you get to a curb, close your eyes and jump off...I did that last night and it produces a small ammount of that intense anxiety feeling which is manageable easy to overcome. I think I may use this as practice with this lesson.



Mike

[forever young 06]

okay I have listened to the relaxtion tape this morning now read part of the lesson in the book. I have a hard time convincing myself I am creating the anxiety and also saying to my self I can't help it. I am trying to really make myself see that. I guess life is stressful and we don't handle it well so it becomes anxiety creating. I am trying to connect more with God I feel it will be more calming. I even use it through the relaxtion tape I keep talking to God. I like where Lucinda says let go and let God that could really be helpful I feel I am trying to be God sometimes trying to control every thing. I wish I could quit looking for body symptoms even when I am not having them. I keep thinking what I have been experiencing lately is anxiety but I am afraid something physically is wrong and it is keeping me from really letting go. I think because my symptoms start with out fear that it isn't caused by fear. But because these symptoms started after quitting my anti depressant later I started with body symptoms and since I can't find a medical reason for the symptoms maybe they are caused by chemicals from the fight or flight system. I hate to keep being out money for test unless I am sure it is medical. okay have a lot to learn and going to try hard to do as the program suggest as my way is not working.
loving all the different input. I feel we can learn from each other. coach chris sure love your input. I feel you guys can see something that I don't. I want to be free once and for all. I need to stop ignoring and running hasn't helped me one bit but kept me stuck. I am tired of this mess and want my life back.

[THH]

I finished reading my lesson 2 book. This maybe more important in understanding than I originally could of understood. I still need to listen to my audio, but got some great tips in the action assignments.
I have not been catching my adrenalin fast enough, recognize soon enough. In order to accept it you have to recognize it. I will pay closer attention and watch for this.
Living in the present is also a thing I have to work at. I do tend to worry about future events. I have a dental cleaning Thursday so today I am not going to think about it as I do not have it today. One day at a time. Today I am going to keep busy with my daily chores and use my relaxation tape.

I also liked the tip to identify the word or sound that you make every time you experience the panic response. Instead of What? or OH no? ( I think are my words to myself )I am going to use I can. I Will.

Ok going for my walk and moving on with the day

Mike,
So glad you feel better with not being the leader. Good you caught that. You are so good at replying to everyone's post I can see how you may feel that way. You are here to help yourself too. We are here for each other but we can't solve each others storys. I too feel happy to go though this again and be with this group. I like that fact that Coach Chris pops in too. Her insight is meaningful.
As is everyone who post on here as well.

Forever,
I feel in many ways like you. This health stuff is horrible. I know... it is an obsession. Feeling for things and panic when you find them.
I like Joel ( Tv preacher ) He always has a uplifting talk and makes you feel excited about looking at the future. I think his sermons go very well with this program. We do have to get our fire back, look for good things to happen.

[Ninjafrodo2]

Forever Young;
You are putting effort forward and even though you might not see how you are creating the anxiety right now, you are open to the possibility that it may be true and thats still heading in the right direction...I know for myself when I don't understand something (I know I had this when it came to guilt and also when it came to forgiveness), I had to first come in contact with this information and then after that I started to keep my eyes open and observe in order to understand more but like you, I couldn't just accept it right off the bat, so give it some time and allow things to sink in, be observant and let the answers find you.

And speaking of which you already seem to be finding some of the answer with working through this and overcoming it...you talked about connecting with god, that part of the audio stuck out for you and resonated with you and it feels good for you, that is a step to getting to where you're going so yeah, you're on the right track


THH
I think catching the adrenaline rush is a skill just like eating food, tying your shoes or learning how to read, the more you practice the better you'll get at it and the quicker you'll be able to recognize it. The dentist visit will be a great opportunity to try it out as it isn't one of the more subtle situations but a rather noticeable one.

And as for the leader thing, i'm really glad that I stopped doing that and i'm glad that people feel like i'm still listening even though i'm not responding to everything! And I'm sorry and I have to be honest, I hadn't responded to your emails awhile ago because I felt like I had to respond to every single thing that was said and our emails were realllllly long! It got really stressful and overwhelming because of that expectation I put on myself...so again i'm sorry, it really had nothing to do with you.


Mike